Dogs & Kids Series Part 2: Is Your Dog Daycare-Ready? Insights and Tips with Dog Trainer Kim Lepic

I created a Dog Daycare Checklist to help you research potential facilities. Grab it here for free!

Welcome to the Dogs & Kids Series! If you've ever considered enrolling your dog in doggy daycare, this episode is for you.

It's something that so many of us parents have considered for our pups after our kids come on the scene and while doggy daycare can be a great outlet for your pup it's also really important to understand what you should expect from a perspective daycare and whether or not daycare is a match for your dog.

So in this episode I'm joined by the insightful Kim Lepic, a dear friend and Certified Professional Dog Trainer with a wealth of experience. Together, we take you on a journey through the world of dog daycare, highlighting the attributes that may suggest your canine companion is daycare-ready.

This episode isn't just about finding a place for your pup to hang out during the day. It's about ensuring that dog daycare becomes a positive experience tailored to your dog's individual needs. Kim and I zoom in on the need for appropriate socialization and its tremendous impact on your dog's daycare experience. We also pinpoint potential risks associated with daycare and share insights on preventing your fur baby from getting too stimulated.

The conversation takes a deeper turn as we share situations when dog daycare might not be the best choice for your canine. We shed light on evaluating a dog's compatibility with other dogs or humans and offer valuable advice for introducing puppies to daycare. It's all about ensuring the right fit for your dog, and sometimes, that might mean they've outgrown daycare - and that's okay! So gear up for a hearty chat filled with doggy wisdom and practical tips that will help you become the dog parent you aspire to be.

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May your dreams be ambitious and may your coffee be strong! xoxo -Rachel Mae

Transcript

Rachel Mae: 0:01

Hey, I'm Rachel Mae, Country Singer, songwriter and host of Mamas Cup of Ambition, the podcast for ambitious mamas with BIG dreams and little kids. Or maybe your kids aren't so little anymore, but your dreams are still just as big as ever. Wherever you find yourself in your motherhood journey, if you've got ambitious goals that you're longing to achieve and you're looking to spark inspiration, cultivate motivation and develop community with like-minded mamas, you're in the right place. As a new mama myself, I created this show as a place for honest and empowering conversations about motherhood, entrepreneurship and dream chasing. So grab a notebook, top off that cup of coffee and let's turn our goals into action plans and our dreams into reality together. Now let's jump into today's episode. Hello, hello and welcome to Mamas Cup of Ambition.

Rachel Mae: 0:49

You are tuned in to another installment of the Dogs and Kids series, and you might be wondering why a podcast that is centered around motherhood and dream chasing is charting into this territory and talking about dogs, and that's a fair question. However, if you share your life with both kids and dogs, then you already know how important it is to find harmony for everyone, to peacefully coexist and to have their needs met, both for the dogs and the humans alike, and when those dynamics are out of alignment at home, it's really hard to give your focus to your bigger ambitions. And so I suppose that's how I'm tying this series into what we generally talk about here on the show, and because, in addition to being a mama and a musician and a podcaster and just an all around multi-passionate person, I have also spent over two decades working closely with dogs in a professional capacity. I have a lot to offer on this subject, and it's something that I'm both passionate about and also that I'm asked about quite often by my mama friends who find themselves navigating challenges with their dogs as their families grow, and since my intention with this podcast is to curate honest, entertaining and helpful conversations around the experience of motherhood that can serve as a resource when you need it most, it seemed like the episode that you're tuned into right now could be just that it could serve as a resource if and when you need it. Now, if you don't have dogs, feel free to skip over this episode or pass it along to somebody that you think might take value or benefit from it, and next week we'll be back to talking about mom life and dream chasing and all that good stuff. Or you know, if you feel inclined and you're curious to stick around, the more the merrier. But now that we've established the context for why this episode is airing, let's talk about what to expect from this conversation and why it matters.

Rachel Mae: 2:42

So, like I said, I've been working professionally with dogs for over two decades and a big portion of my work has been centered around working in the dog daycare arena, and that's what we're going to be talking about today. So I've had so many mamas reach out to me over the years with questions about navigating the dynamics between their dogs and their kids, specifically after the arrival of a new baby, which makes sense, right, because everything changes when a baby comes on the scene, not only for us mamas but also for our pups. And quite often the question that comes up is should they consider daycare as an outlet for their dog? But it's a tricky question to ask on one level, because every dog is different, just like us, and every daycare is different, and some dogs just aren't a match for daycare or it's just not going to be their thing, and that's totally fine. But it's really important to understand that as you're going into dog daycare for your dog, because you could very easily start out taking your dog to daycare thinking that you're going to help your situation and end up making things harder for yourself if your dog isn't a fan of daycare and things go sideways. One, they could get hurt. Two, they could hurt somebody else. Three, they could end up with a bunch of new behavioral challenges that then you have to try to navigate. So all of that to say it's a complicated question to answer when somebody asks me if I think that dog daycare would be a good way for their dog to release some energy now that the new baby is around.

Rachel Mae: 4:06

And so, for this part of the dogs and kids series, I brought my friend Kim Lepic on the show for an honest, deep dive conversation where we'll explore the qualities that might indicate whether or not your dog might be a good fit for doggy daycare. Kim is a dear friend and she and I worked together for years and years in the daycare arena, and she's also an incredible professional dog trainer with a wealth of experience. So she really brought some great insight to this conversation and I think you will take a lot from it if this is something that you're currently considering or may consider sometime in the future. So without further ado, let's jump into my conversation with Kim Lepic. It's going to be so hard to be professional right now. I feel like I get in your presence and then I just immediately revert back to like the middle school version of myself that thinks everything is like funny and I just want to like giggle at everything.

Kim Lepic: 5:02

Oh my God be cause it is .

Rachel Mae: 5:04

I've always considered you to be a mentor and I feel like I've learned so much from you, not only from, like, all of our years in the daycare yards, but like watching you work with Julie and just being in your world. I feel like I've managed to learn so much from you, and when I ventured out and started to do my own stuff in the realm of like wanting to learn more about training dogs and understanding how dogs communicate with us and the world, you were really a big influence in that. So I don't know if I've told you that, but I want you to know that you've been influential on my experience and career with dogs, so it's fitting that I have you here for this series. Oh, thank you.

Kim Lepic: 5:40

I'm honored Been in the industry, as you have for a long time, so I think we truly grew together. Though, yes, like you learn so much as you go, so I just feel like, as long as you're open to learning, you're always learning. I'm in the dog industry, so I feel like we grew a lot together.

Rachel Mae: 5:57

Yeah for sure. So for a little bit of context, I'm here today with Kim Lepic, who Kim and I have been friends for a very long time. Kim and I worked together at a dog daycare, so I really wanted to have Kim on today. Kim has her own dog training business. She left the Pacific Northwest Actually, it was sort of around the time that I started having kids. I mean, I'm not saying it was personal, but that's interesting.

Kim Lepic: 6:25

Okay, I'm out.

Rachel Mae: 6:26

No.

Kim Lepic: 6:27

I guess that is true, though, because you had Waylon in the spring of 2020. And I left January of 2020.

Rachel Mae: 6:33

You're like the world's going to lock down. I'm going to sunny California, I'm getting out. So you moved to California and you've got your own dog training business. Do you want to tell us a little bit about it?

Kim Lepic: 6:44

Sure, it's called a Low Hop Positive Dog Training and I opened it, so we moved in January of 2020 and then I started going through the state getting all the legalities through, and then I did, and then COVID shut down it, so it kind of put a damper on it for a while. But yeah, I provide private lessons and day training for everybody from, if you know the area and so Cal, from Temecula to Oceanside Awesome.

Rachel Mae: 7:09

I know it's cool because you're on Instagram now and you've got a profile for your training and you give great tips and stuff there, so we can link to that, so people can follow you. Even if they're not in California, they can still learn from you in some capacity. Perfect, really. So the point of having Kim on here today like I said, we both have a background in the dog daycare space and you can probably hear my dog in the background barking because, like I was telling Kim before we hit record, the landscapers are here. I really need to adjust my recording schedule because I know that the landscapers come on Mondays and I record on Mondays.

Rachel Mae: 7:46

But Birdie just has some commentary for this series that she would like to chime in with. It's very fitting. Yeah, it's only right she's got something to say, but the premise of this episode is really to talk about daycare as an option. I know a lot of times when kids come on the scene, if you've got dogs at home, things can feel a little bit more chaotic and sometimes it's hard to effectively meet your dog's needs and feel like you're filling their cup, so to speak, the way that you did before you had kids, and I know for a lot of people. An obvious way to sort of fix that issue is dog daycare, and so it's something.

Rachel Mae: 8:26

Having worked in this industry for like two decades, it's something that I get asked about a lot, and I really wanted to have Kim on today to discuss what characteristics might make a dog a good fit for dog daycare, because it isn't a one size fits all by any means. So I think it's really important to kind of have some qualifiers to determine if your dog is gonna be a good candidate for dog daycare, and hopefully the daycare facility that you're taking your dog to will also help you to understand how your dog might do in this type of environment. But you can't really just rely on the dog daycares. It's really it's a collaborative process, so you really want to be showing up informed and understanding what you're signing your dog up for before you start the process. So that's why we're here today and it's what we're gonna be diving into. So I guess we'll just kick things off with what I just said. So, kim, in your opinion, what are some of the characteristics that you think make a dog a good fit for dog daycare? I would say.

Kim Lepic: 9:27

One of the first things is that your dog reads other dog's law, meaning their body language. So knowing back off cues or invite through body language, so that the dog is comfortable and can read other dogs and know when to back up or when to pursue and that type of thing. Another one is being comfortable in that type of environment in general, like new environments or just that environment, because it is a lot depending on the daycare the group's very, you know, you can have four to six dogs or some daycares have like 30 dogs. So just being comfortable in that environment is really important. Plus, I think there's also a human social aspect, obviously, and I don't mean the dog has to be, you know, your average lab, so to speak. That's gonna be super zuber and I love everybody in that type of thing.

Kim Lepic: 10:16

But there has to be a human social factor where the people have to be able to handle them appropriately.

Kim Lepic: 10:23

If there was an emergency or if they did get hurt or, you know, broke a toenail or that type of thing, like the people have to, the staff have to be able to handle the dog without the fear of getting bit or that type of thing. So that human social handling aspect is also pretty important and, don't get me wrong, I mean the dog walking in may be a little weary, but the staff should also be growing relationships and things like that. So, but definitely a human, social aspect, I think. And that being said too, I know, rachel, we've seen plenty of dogs that well, every dog in the individual right. So if there is a shy dog that comes in, we've seen them be able to gain confidence and build their dog skills and that type of thing. So it's not that your dog has to walk in this perfect dog into a facility. There can be some shaping and learning and things, but definitely I would say the past few things that I've said just now are really core skills that they either come with or can grow into.

Rachel Mae: 11:22

Yeah, I can think of a lot of dogs just off the top of my head from the years and years in the yards of daycare. Indy comes to mind for one, like I was still very new to understanding and reading dogs when I started that job. And there's this dog, indy, who she took some time to warm up to you, and I very much. So I remember it was like my first day in the yard with her. She tried to bite me. It was because, like, I wasn't reading her appropriately and I wasn't giving her the space that she needed for that warm up period and so over time she became my obsession and I still have her picture on my Christmas tree on an ornament every year because we bonded and we became, she became my work dog. But I do think like there's a difference between that Like she had certain things that she needed from the people who were interacting with her, but under those conditions she was able to thrive versus, like my dog Haas, for example. He's not a great fit for daycare for that reason. Like he's very, very unsure about people he doesn't know and it takes him a really long time to feel confident with strangers, and that's with me involved and in the process and so, if you take me out of the equation, what you're saying, I'm really glad that you touched on that of that like the staff needs to be able to feel like they can interact with your dog and move them around just within the facility. There's different ways that they're gonna be needing to move them from space to space and leashing them up and feeling confident in doing that and, like for me, I just know one. It wouldn't be fair to a daycare for me to put Haas in that environment and be like here you work that out. But also it wouldn't be fair to Haas to put that kind of pressure on him and to expect him to adapt to an environment that I know isn't really for him.

Rachel Mae: 13:14

Now, if it was an environment like I used to have a small in-home daycare operation and Haas loved that because it was the same small group of dogs and it was me there with him, but under the right conditions, like I think, if it was a smaller operation and there was time and space for us to build up that bond with the person, before I just dropped him off and was like, okay, maybe he could succeed.

Rachel Mae: 13:39

But I'm really glad that you pointed out the like human component, because I think a lot of times when we think about dog daycare, we're kind of just thinking about, like well, my dog needs socialization, there are other dogs there, my dog can socialize, and so that's kind of something I want to back up to as well, because I feel like the word socialization gets thrown around a lot, especially when we talk about daycare, and I think there's a little bit of confusion sometimes around what socialization is. Again, it's not just a one size fits all like not every dog needs to go be in a group of 20 to 30 dogs to have socialization, and so I'd love to just kind of talk about what socialization in dog daycare looks like and how that impacts like a dog's success in that environment. If that makes sense, yeah.

Kim Lepic: 14:25

I mean just talking about, like you said, socialization in general gets thrown out a lot and I think we've, at least in my genre and my network we are really starting to see a shift, not just socialization but proper socialization. Because people think, oh, I just take my dog and throw him in the middle of a play ball field with kids playing baseball and bikes and what it like, and they're just socializing and it's like, well, maybe or you might be doing some emotional damage, right, yeah, so proper socialization to me is making positive associations with the world. So every dog is an individual. So even my dog like Hula, like, yeah, five pound Hula, when I got her eight weeks old, like, hey, how are you? Hey, how are you? Like, she was just like miss social. But then I get radar and he was very opposite.

Kim Lepic: 15:17

So you have to structure your socialization for the individual dog. So, again, not that they can't like gain confidence with proper socialization, but I feel like socialization as a whole is all about creating positive associations or even having neutral associations. Right, they don't have to. You know, oh, look, there's a bike, and they're excited like just saying like, oh, there's a bike, that's nice, right, just positive or neutral, but for that proper socialization to pay off.

Rachel Mae: 15:47

So, yeah, I think like trying to force these interactions to where we feel like sometimes I think we may have the best intentions or that we think, like my dog needs the socialization, so I just need to like get them over this hump so they can have this exposure, so that they can get used to it. And I am trying to remember I feel like it was in the Culture Clash book, maybe- that's taken me back.

Rachel Mae: 16:08

Don't quote me on this because I don't. I'm trying to remember if this is where I heard this analogy. But it was like if you were like tied up to a chair so you're on a leash or whatever, and there was somebody with a chainsaw and I was like, hey, they're not going to hurt you with it, though, but I'm just going to inch you closer to it, but you don't have the ability to like move away from that. You're still going to be like no, I don't really want to go near the chainsaw guy. Even if you're saying that I can trust that he's not going to do anything like, I still don't really want to go near. Just like the visual of that of like.

Rachel Mae: 16:36

If you can try to get into your own experience and imagine that from your dog's perspective of like, you might know that it's not a genuine threat what you're trying to expose them to.

Rachel Mae: 16:47

But that doesn't mean that they understand that any more than you would understand that the chainsaw guy isn't a threat.

Rachel Mae: 16:54

And I think just sort of reimagining and rethinking the way that we think about socialization, and just sort of understanding that dropping your dog off at daycare is not the means to tackle socialization for your dog and a lot of cases make things a lot worse.

Rachel Mae: 17:08

In fact, if you drop your dog off and they're not a good fit for it and especially depending on the daycare like if there are some great daycares out there who are very open and honest with their communication, but unfortunately there are also a lot of daycares that aren't, and so if you get into a daycare where they aren't being transparent and honest with you about what your dog is experiencing in their facility and you don't know because you're not there, but it's like if you don't know what your dog's experience is, you really need to have a facility that you know you can trust that they're going to give you honest and open feedback, even if it's not what you want to hear. Like I've been the one to have to deliver the news that a dog can't come back to daycare. I know Kim has had to do it.

Rachel Mae: 17:49

It's countless times, it's awful it is.

Kim Lepic: 17:52

It is awful, but really it's about the dog, right? Yeah, like that's what we used to communicate is as much as this might hurt the people's feelings, because we're here for the dog and we want the dog to succeed. And that might not be the daycare environment, and I do love the fact that you touched on. Every facility is different and it's so true because you can have that you know shy dog that needs to gain some confidence and if you have the right facility, they can absolutely help with that. Obviously, there's stuff on the outside of those walls that you need to do as well, but if you pick the wrong facility and they're just throwing them into a group of 30 dogs and they're, you know, again trapped in this chair with the chainsaw coming out of all the time, it can make things way worse.

Rachel Mae: 18:37

So I think the facility is very important like you said, that's kind of the reason I wanted to create this episode is because I think, again, our intentions are good. Like we might think, like oh, I'm not able to give my dog everything that they need right now because my focus is split and I'm trying to keep a tiny human alive now and you want to do something for them that you feel like is going to enhance their life or give them a better quality of life, and you might think that it's going to benefit both of you. Like you get them out of the house, they get to go and burn off some energy and be a dog and do dog things, and you get to like be at home with the kid and have a dog come home tired and that can be the case and that can be great. But if, again, if it's not done in the right context and for the right dog in the right environment, you may end up with a dog who is coming home with a new host of behavioral issues that now you have to try to navigate or like not all levels of tired are equal. I think is important to point out as well, like this comes back to really vetting your facilities because you don't want to just send them to where the dog is just like go ahead and just run yourself ragged all day long until you are just overextended, overstimulated. That's not great for the dog and that's not going to be great for you when you go to pick them up either. So I know we keep talking about the facility, that it matters, but it's really. It's true. You really need to kind of show up to these facilities informed and know what questions to ask so that you can know what you're walking into or know what you're setting yourself up for and know that your dog actually wants the activity that you're trying to lovingly provide for them. Absolutely.

Rachel Mae: 20:16

Kim knows this about me. This is the example I love to give is I hate bowling and there are people who love bowling and they think it's a good time. It's a great way to spend a Friday night. If you drop me off at the bowling alley every week, multiple times a week, I'm not going to learn to love bowling more, but probably I'm going to just start being like more annoyed that I'm at the bowling alley.

Rachel Mae: 20:36

I'm going to find more things about it than annoy me and my like aversion for it is just going to go stronger because now I'm being forced into something that I don't enjoy doing and I think we think in our minds we're doing our dogs a favor. We're like he's a dog, he should love this. But if your dog, if that's not their jam and that's okay if it's not, but if daycare isn't their vibe and you keep forcing them into that scenario, the same is true for them, they're not going to come home and be like. I'm so glad you forced me to just like get over my aversion to dog daycare. I like that analogy. Well, I thought you would. I know, you know that I'm not a fan of the bowling life, but it's so fun, rachel.

Rachel Mae: 21:21

Not to me, it's not. We have the shoes, the borrowed shoes and stuff. I could do a whole other podcast about this. I feel like I've spent like so much time trying to convince people who love bowling that bowling sucks and they try to convince me that bowling is awesome. It's a never ending loop and I'm still on the no bowling side.

Rachel Mae: 21:42

So what would you say? I mean, we've kind of touched on this a little bit, but what are some of the temperaments and personality traits that might indicate that a dog going to daycare, that it would be counterproductive for them?

Kim Lepic: 21:52

I think the obvious one would be people are dog aggressive. Yeah, just not the right fit, like there's other ways to enrich your dog's life without daycare, for sure. And then another one, even in my opinion, would be dog tolerant dogs. Yeah, so dog tolerant dogs, meaning they have select friends that they like, or dog selected, if you want to say, but they have select dog friends that they like, but they wouldn't actually enjoy that environment. So, in turn, their dog tolerance can decrease because they're being like you with bowling, heli, right, like they're being forced into these situations because they don't get in fights and they don't, you know, aren't disruptive, but they're only tolerating it. So I feel like there's this fine line of dog tolerant, and again, in turn, it can make it worse just if they're keep being forced into those environments Totally. So the best way to get to the right facility, though, is the way the daycare is set up, and they do like rotate through and kind of give breaks and that type of thing, and they compare them with their friends. They think that that would be a good facility for a dog tolerant dog.

Kim Lepic: 22:56

Yeah, actually, when I moved down here, covid hit, so I didn't. I was unemployed, but I found a part-time job at a facility and that's how they did it and it was amazing. Yeah, so it was like these dogs who couldn't be for sure in like a 15 plus dog group yeah, they had their groups for like four to six dogs. It was just a great dynamic. So it was amazing to see that and the dog tolerant dogs actually succeeded because we knew who their friends were and that type of thing. So if you have a dog tolerant dog, just beware of that type of thing. I would also say not a good fit would be those overly anxious or shy, fearful dogs, and I have seen shy dogs come around and like gain confidence. But if they're like overly fearful or overly anxious, you can actually do more damage.

Rachel Mae: 23:46

So those guys, do you think like separation anxiety there groups into that too? Because I know like a lot of dogs with separation anxiety. I feel like that sort of becomes like the solution that a lot of folks find for their dogs is because they can't leave them at home or the dog has so much social Separation anxiety that they lean on daycare for that. Would you group like separation anxiety in there too or kind of?

Kim Lepic: 24:10

Again, I think it kind of comes to the facility.

Kim Lepic: 24:13

So if it's a dog and they're truly trying to work on their separation anxiety, I know one of the first things that the expert will tell you is they cannot be alone. So you can find a facility. Or you know again somebody like you when you had your small day care, so you have kind of that outlet for them while you're Instituting some training and be either a modification right, I think the right facility could be a good fit, but I would say not a facility that you know if the dog has trouble with confinement and they're like Rotating through and giving them breaks and the dog is panicking in a crater kennel, not the right fit. So yeah, and then I was gonna add the opposite side of that spectrum would be those over exuberant no, I'm next time dog right, we've all had them and in our group and they can be disruptive and create chaos and just literally stress for all involved staff, other dogs that are trying to rest, like again, I think it takes the right facility for that type of dog.

Kim Lepic: 25:14

Yeah but those over exuberant, over social. Very high energy can create a lot of chaos.

Rachel Mae: 26:08

My mind is just like going back through memory lane. I knew it would. It's been a while since I've been in like a proper Daycare yard full of dogs. Well, it's haven't been that long actually, but I don't know. My mind does immediately I can like for each of these characteristics. I can think of the different facilities that I've worked in where there were different policies and procedures around the dogs that were being Accepted, and I can. There's definitely experiences that stand out of like they had the dogs best interest and that was like the focus of what's best for the dog. And then there's those cases where that obviously wasn't the setup and you're right it does stressful for everyone, dogs and humans alike.

Kim Lepic: 26:50

So and I feel like back in the day, I feel like we kind of had all of that in our group. Yeah, and again, we've learned a lot from those experiences and I feel like we dealt with them well, because some of the dogs in all of those Categories I just named actually did end up doing pretty well. Yeah, you know whether we taught them how to relax in a group or help them gain confidence, but there were definitely ones that were again created chaos.

Rachel Mae: 27:15

I think that's the other cool thing about daycare like when it's done right and the dog is a compatible Fit for it. I don't want to like scare people away from daycare as an option, because I think when it's done right and if the dog is actually into daycare, it can be incredible and it can be like a real opportunity for the dog to like learn and grow and experience so many different things and I do think that daycare is really beneficial. I just I know it's not for every dog and I know that not all facilities are created equal, and so anytime I have a soapbox to get on to talk about this Because I feel like it's important, because the stakes are high too right. Like, what we expect of the dogs and what we expect of our dogs in general is not often Mirrored what we expect of ourselves. I think there's sort of this mindset of like well, my dog should want to be in that group of 20 to 30 dogs, but that's a lot in some cases, especially depending on the group. Like you and I have both been in groups of dogs when you can have 20 to 30 dogs and they can all vibe a certain way and then, like the next day there's like a different group of dogs, the same number, but the dynamic, something is just off and it changes everything and you're just trying to put fires out all day and I think like asking the dogs to go through that too, like we wouldn't want to do that.

Rachel Mae: 28:36

As people like to give another analogy, it's like I'm an introverted extrovert, like I can be extroverted when I need to be, but I don't necessarily like to be out in big crowds of people all the time. And if you shove me into a crowd full of people and tell me to like make small talk, that is like I don't want to do that, like I would rather do anything Than that, and it's like I don't put those Expectations on myself. And I think we need to be mindful of, like what we're asking of our dogs as well. Again, I know that it comes from the place of wanting to do something Compassionate, kind for your dog, because you love them. And I think a lot of times too, when kids come on the scene, like for me, I was able to do so much more with my dogs before having kids that, like now I just can't. I can't do it in the same Capacity.

Rachel Mae: 29:24

It's different, and so I'm always looking for ways to have that bond and to still Connect with my dogs in the way that I did before having kids and to give them Experiences and a good quality of life, because that really matters to me.

Rachel Mae: 29:36

It matters to me just as much as it matters that my kids have that, and so I really have like strong Understanding and a heart for why people would want to explore this as an option, and I think there are just like you don't need to feel disappointed or disheartened if you're hearing this and thinking like well, now what if, like clearly what you're saying my dog falls into, like this category or that category? There are lots of different options and your dog can do so that they can still have a good quality of life and still have their needs met and you can have your Sanity and some like calm collectively in your household, but something that works for everybody involved. So something that I think would be really important for us to touch on is how do you go about Evaluating your dog's compatibility with other dogs or with other people? What solutions for how people might kind of gauge or evaluate their dogs compatibility before they take it to the next step of Evaluation day at a daycare.

Kim Lepic: 30:33

I usually one of my first suggestions is to Ask the help of a friend or a family member who has a dog's neutral or calm dog. Having that neutral, calm dog that won't be pushy or shy, it just kind of exists for lack of a better term Like just kind of a dog who's like, hey, how's it going? Like no big deal if the dog wants to sniff them, great. If they don't want to sniff them, great. Granted, those dogs are hard to come by Sometimes.

Kim Lepic: 30:59

Yeah, but just trying to find somebody you know again family or friends, it's a known dog, yeah, you know it's vaccinated, you know it's healthy, all that good stuff. But that's kind of where I that's my first go to. Another one would be if you do have a puppy looking like under 16 weeks ish, I would look for Like a reputable group puppy class I. So again, I say reputable because you don't want the class is going to just throw the chihuahua with the great chain and everything in between and you know, really evaluating size, temperament and again, size doesn't always matter, right, it is temperament as well.

Kim Lepic: 31:35

One of the best combos in one of my puppy classes that I always reflect on is chihuahua and german shepherd. Like it was amazing that chihuahua was a little older, the shepherd was younger, so that chihuahua could like run circles around the stock and the german shepherd was so polite and sweet and the chihuahua going under it and over it and around it and they had a great time. So size doesn't always matter. It's definitely like temperament as well. But finding the right group class for the puppy, yeah, so not only can they gain some social skills with the right fit, but they can also gain some basic foundation skills and that type of thing.

Kim Lepic: 32:12

Yeah, so if you have a puppy, that's a good one. Or, and also, like you were saying, like kind of my go to, is that reputable facility that actually does those evaluations for you, and kind of leaving it to the professional, because it is hard to know without putting your dog in danger, without you know, or another dog, if you're unsure about your dog. So, and that's where the dog park gets sketchy sometimes, because you don't know what you're gonna get, and not only like behaviorally but health wise.

Kim Lepic: 32:42

You know, somebody could have all horse availments and take them to the dog park or they I mean again you hear the horror stories of all the dog fights at dog parks because you never know what you're gonna get.

Rachel Mae: 32:52

So I would leave it to the professional find the right facility and have them do a proper evaluation is kind of another go to I wasn't planning on really touching on this, but I do think it's important to kind of talk about the dog park thing for a second to, because I think we're focusing on daycares, but there might be some folks who think like I'll just take them to the dog park and let them run out their energy, and I do think it's worth saying like a lot of what we're talking about here crosses over into that. Only it can be even more explosive because you have all these different people there and different dogs there. I've seen people bring their kids there and they're letting their kids run, and it's like there's a lot of liability there as well. If you don't know even if you do know your dog very well and you know how you think they're going to respond in a situation when you put your dog into the dog park scenario and you have all of this out of your control, you're kind of rolling the dice on a lot of things, and so I think there's a lot of crossover here too that I would really consider if you are thinking about taking your dog to a dog park.

Rachel Mae: 33:57

There's something called sniff spots. I'm pretty sure sniff spots are like pretty. They're starting to spread to a lot of different parts of the country pretty fast, but you basically, if you don't know what it is, you go on the app and you can browse. You can put in some parameters for what you're looking for and you can browse for different locations and basically people rent out their space. Sometimes there's like we've taken our dogs on some cool trails and, specifically with sniff spot, like you have to rent the space by the hour, which sounds weird but you take your dogs and you read the space by the hour and they get to go and play and have a dedicated space to sniff and run and have all of that like dog goodness, but in a controlled setting where you know there's like some standards and you know it's just your dogs.

Rachel Mae: 34:47

I've also like I have a handful that we use where I've checked with the owners to make sure that it's okay that the kids come, and then, like I strap Wyatt into the ergo and let the kids come with me and like make sure that they're away because the dogs will start running their track. I don't want to get in the wrong direction, I don't want anybody to get knocked over, but if you communicate and work with some of those locations, not all of them want kids on their property for obvious reasons liability or whatever. But there's a lot that I have communicated with that have okayed us bringing the kids and then I get to have that whole family experience with my dogs and kids in a safe, controlled way. So really, if you're thinking about just going to the dog park, I would encourage you to take what we're talking about here and apply that with even more caution to that scenario.

Kim Lepic: 35:37

I agree, yes, and six spots great to, because again communicating with the host is great, but it's also at least the ones down in so cal, like there is little as ten or fifteen bucks an hour, like it's been great. Like referring to clients and all of that with the reactive dogs or what have you. Or you have a dog having their own space to again run and be a dog.

Rachel Mae: 35:58

Mean, it's huge asset yeah, that's a great way to. If you did have a friend that was gonna bring a dog for an introduction to, that would be a great place to Facilitate that. So you can have a space where you know you're not gonna have dogs coming and going as you're trying to get an introduction, because you're not gonna get a very clear picture what's actually happening between those dogs if you've got people coming in and out, dogs running past kids going past cars pulling up, and so Sniff spots can be really great, for this is not sponsored by sniff spot anyway, but we're both clearly just fans of it because it giving options to dog lovers that may have very few other options.

Kim Lepic: 36:42

I'm one of those people. I definitely don't have dog park dog.

Rachel Mae: 36:47

I have kids. Like it's not gonna happen. So one last thing I want to touch on really quickly before I let you go, even though I could talk to you all day if you touched briefly about like puppies and puppy classes. But what would you say are like best practices for puppies and daycare? Like, if somebody has a new puppy at home and they're like, okay, I'm gonna get him signed up for daycare, what advice would you give that person?

Kim Lepic: 37:11

listening, no again going back to we've said it a couple times, I think that vetting the facility, like really you know, going in, taking a tour, asking questions just to make sure that again they're not just not gonna be a free for all. You want people that have you know appropriate size crew. You're looking for people of facilities in particular, not just people but the facilities that you know. Talk about dog body language. How do they do their introductions when you bring in a new dog? Yeah, you know one at a time, until eventually there was a group visit, all we just put him in the play group and off you go. So, kind of knowing that.

Kim Lepic: 37:49

Also, ask them if they have any nanny dogs, because nanny dogs, which are dogs that are great with puppies and help teach them social skills, those are great to have in daycare is not every daycare has them and not that that's a problem, but if they do, that's amazing. Hey, if they know what a nanny dog is, right, yeah, that's a huge thing. Um, so if they have any nanny dogs, it's great. But kind of asking questions of the facility, of how, how, what does the day look like?

Rachel Mae: 38:17

even right, like yeah important for all dogs, but especially for puppies, like again we talked about that, like there's a difference between tired and having needs met and Exhausted and feeling like run down by the end of the day, and especially for puppies like that can be.

Kim Lepic: 38:35

So, so much and so overwhelming also in talking about that. Like the puppy, you find the right facility and it's going great. Also, just something to mention is some dogs age out of daycare. So people think, oh, I found this great facility and my dogs doing great, and then they hit like 12 or 15 months old and then they just don't want to be there anymore. And that's okay too. I'm so glad you said that so, and it's not that the dog is aggressive, but they just again, they become dog tolerant typically as they age like dog tolerant. Dog selective is actually where most dogs lie, yeah, and that's that's great. But but yeah, so kind of keeping that in mind as the pet parent, right.

Rachel Mae: 39:16

I'm so glad you said that. I think that's really important because it is an evolving process. Right? It's like you said you'd find the daycare and you think, okay, I did it, I did the thing, I found it. In reality, it's very much like our kids, like they are going to transition through seasons of and they're like Development.

Rachel Mae: 39:32

Yeah, like the early education classes that I took wayland to wouldn't be the same classes that he's in now as a three-year-old. So it's the same for our dogs as they move through these Phases of development in their life they're going to have different needs, just like our kids have different needs. And doesn't mean your dogs bad or that they've done something wrong, and it's actually a great sign if your daycare is willing to communicate those things with you and is Aware enough of what's going on with your dog to be able to communicate. That, I think, is the mark of Actually a good facility. So I'm so glad that you mentioned that because I think that's Key for every stage of the dog's life, because the same thing happens too when they get older. There's a lot of dogs who are seniors who like that's going to be a lot on an old dog to be, not to say that it can't work for some of those dogs, depending on the facility. But your dog's needs may be changing and evolving and that's okay too.

Kim Lepic: 40:27

Absolutely, I think. Again, they just kind of goes back to dogs or individuals too, right. So just knowing, knowing your dog and Finding the right facility, if you're going to go that route and roll with it, amazing.

Rachel Mae: 40:41

Well, this has been amazing, kim. I can't believe I convinced you to do this Me either, actually.

Rachel Mae: 40:48

I'm so glad that you're here. I really, like you, were the first person I thought of when it's like, well, I could hop on here and just have this conversation with myself, but that might be really important. It would be a lot more engaging to have kim on, and so I'm so happy that you indulged me in this, and I feel like this episode is going to serve as a really good resource for a lot of Dog lovers out there. Whether you have human children or not, this can be very helpful. So I really appreciate you taking time to come on here with me, and Anytime I get to see your face, even virtually, it's a good day for me.

Kim Lepic: 41:26

So Thanks, and thank you so much for thinking of me. It's very kind of you, oh kim.

Rachel Mae: 41:32

Yeah, I always think of you, but I'm glad I got to bring you on the podcast now so that other folks can think of you too when they when they think of their dog and how their dog is moving through the world. And, like I said, I will link in the show description to kim's instagram.

Kim Lepic: 41:48

Another thing I should mention is, if anybody's interested in like enrichment ideas, I actually have a handout that's downloadable on my website. So awesome a low-hop, positive dog training, calm and just go to resources and whether your dog's a good fit for daycare or not. It might give you some fresh ideas on how to provide enrichment to meet their needs.

Rachel Mae: 42:13

That's it for today's episode, but if you want to continue the conversation, I'd love to connect with you, and you can find me over on instagram at mama's cup of ambition, and I've also linked today's guests and their information below to make it super easy for you to connect with them as well. And if you got something out of this episode, it would be so meaningful if you would consider leaving the show a rating and review. Okay, until next time, may your dreams be ambitious and may your coffee be strong. I'll talk to you soon.